What is in Armour, and what about T1 & T2?
in [Thyroid]
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From: Elizabeth on 10 Apr 2008 11:18 Hi all, I've been following the discussion on switching to Armour from Synthroid with interest. I was diagnosed in January and decided to give Synthroid a try first. I have noticed gradual improvement although I am by no means feeling great yet after 8 weeks (starting at only 25 mcg and increasing to just 37.5 mcg after 6 weeks - very slow progress, but TSH is down to around 3 and fT4 is up a little). After reading websites such as stopthethyroidmadness.org and the syndicated newspaper column The Peoples' Pharmacy, it's tempting to jump to Armour immediately. But I hesitate to "jack" my system with fast-acting T3 if I really don't have to. My gut feeling is that gradual processes are easier on the body than sudden ones, an analogy being crash dieting versus steady weight loss. However, if the desired result simply cannot be obtained in a gradual way, of course I would feel differently. And if I were unable to function, I would also change my mind. The question I am leading to is, do people feel that it is the T4/T3 combo of Armour that works, or is it the mysterious T1, T2, and possibly other organic things within the natural thyroid that make it work? Does synthetic T3 (Cytomel) have the same effect as Armour when added to synthetic T4? If so many doctors are against Armour, what are their main concerns besides dose variability, which has pretty much been discounted at this point, I believe? Thanks, Elizabeth
From: Rod on 10 Apr 2008 11:49 Elizabeth wrote: > Hi all, > > I've been following the discussion on switching to Armour from Synthroid > with interest. I was diagnosed in January and decided to give Synthroid a > try first. I have noticed gradual improvement although I am by no means > feeling great yet after 8 weeks (starting at only 25 mcg and increasing to > just 37.5 mcg after 6 weeks - very slow progress, but TSH is down to around > 3 and fT4 is up a little). > > After reading websites such as stopthethyroidmadness.org and the syndicated > newspaper column The Peoples' Pharmacy, it's tempting to jump to Armour > immediately. But I hesitate to "jack" my system with fast-acting T3 if I > really don't have to. My gut feeling is that gradual processes are easier on > the body than sudden ones, an analogy being crash dieting versus steady > weight loss. However, if the desired result simply cannot be obtained in a > gradual way, of course I would feel differently. And if I were unable to > function, I would also change my mind. > > The question I am leading to is, do people feel that it is the T4/T3 combo > of Armour that works, or is it the mysterious T1, T2, and possibly other > organic things within the natural thyroid that make it work? Does synthetic > T3 (Cytomel) have the same effect as Armour when added to synthetic T4? > > If so many doctors are against Armour, what are their main concerns besides > dose variability, which has pretty much been discounted at this point, I > believe? > > Thanks, > Elizabeth > > Elizabeth, Firstly taking your question too literally, Forest <http://www.armourthyroid.com/> say: "Armour Thyroid Complete List of Ingredients The Armour Thyroid product available from Forest Pharmaceuticals contains: 1. Thyroid Powder, USP 2. Dextrose, Anhydrous 3. Microcrystalline Cellulose, NF 4. Sodium Starch Glycolate, NF 5. Calcium Stearate, NF 6. Opadry White (titanium dioxide used as a whitening agent) Armour Thyroid does not contain gluten or lactose." I have yet to see a decent analysis of what the Thyroid Powder, USP actually contains in terms of its constituent chemical compounds. I am perfectly happy to believe that Armour is of immense value to some people - whether they take 100% Armour or some combination of Armour and thyroxine or even Cytomel. However, I am also happy to believe that some people do fine on thyroxine only. or even Cytomel only. I am very unhappy with people who appear to proclaim "YOU MUST TAKE ARMOUR" as their apparent agenda. As far as I am concerned it is something to be considered and used or not as you see fit. All hypos should have the option. If I were you, I *think* that I would stick with thyroxine for a while yet. -- Rod Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious onset. Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed. <www.thyromind.info> <www.thyroiduk.org> <www.altsupportthyroid.org>
From: bj on 10 Apr 2008 12:20 "Rod" <polygonum(a)ntlworld.com> wrote in message news:666r7vF2hs0f6U1(a)mid.individual.net... > > I am very unhappy with people who appear to proclaim "YOU MUST TAKE > ARMOUR" as their apparent agenda. As far as I am concerned it is something > to be considered and used or not as you see fit. All hypos should have the > option. > > If I were you, I *think* that I would stick with thyroxine for a while > yet. > I agree with you. I did just fine on T4 only for over 10 years. I've done just fine on T4 only for another 8 after having my thyroid removed/remnants ablated for cancer. And it is *so much more convenient* to need only the one pill, so if it works for you (& you don't know until you give it a proper chance at the right dose) then I'd say stick with it. bj
From: Christina in Florida on 10 Apr 2008 12:24 Hi Elizabeth, I'm a newbie to Armour (3 days as of today) and was on Synthroid for two years plus prior to Armour. What I'm sharing is just my current thoughts based on where I am on my journey to wellness. I'm still trying to put the pieces together so that I can feel comfortable with whatever treatment choices I make. Here are some things I read about Armour yesterday in various books by various authors: - Two books talked about the fact that Armour has T3 and T4 in addition to things that will help to metabolize the thyroid hormone (not sure what these "things" are but selenium and calcitonin were mentioned. I'm confused by this because I don't see those included in the post from Rod that lists what Forest says it has in it. - One of the books also mentioned that Armour doesn't just replace a function of the thyroid gland, it also nourishes the gland. I like the idea but don't know the scientific details to back this claim up. My thoughts on your switching are that: A) Not everyone needs T3 replacement. B) I'm sure there are books, sites, and others here who can suggest blood tests that your doc can order and use to determine whether your T3 is lacking and whether that is due to conversion issues or other reasons. This would be important to understand and follow if you continue with Synthroid. C) You've only been on Synthroid for 8 short weeks. I would consider attempting to find a Synthroid dose that may work for you. It will require patience, because every dose change requires 6-8 weeks to fully take effect. I was comfortable with switching to Armour because Synthroid hasn't worked for me and it has had more than enough of a chance, in my opinion. I'm still nervous because, well, I don't magically feel better overnight, but...that's not a realistic expectation for me to have so I have to work on that. My situation is a little more "muddied" because I have adrenal fatigue issues on top of the thyroid issues. What I'm really getting from my recent experiences (reading, talking with others, and my own experience) is that thyroid treatment is as much art as science. There are labs that can be ordered and adjustments that can be made to bring someone into "normal range" (of TSH or other hormones) but the person may still need treatments "tweaked" because they need to be at the high or low end of normal and not in the middle. It really is difficult to grasp. I wish it was more of a true science where once you achieved a certain number you could be assured you would feel fine. I hope that serves to help and not confuse. I wish you Blessings as you continue along your path to wellness! ~ Christina On Apr 10, 11:18 am, "Elizabeth" <esniv...(a)earthlink.net> wrote: > Hi all, > > I've been following the discussion on switching to Armour from Synthroid > with interest. I was diagnosed in January and decided to give Synthroid a > try first. I have noticed gradual improvement although I am by no means > feeling great yet after 8 weeks (starting at only 25 mcg and increasing to > just 37.5 mcg after 6 weeks - very slow progress, but TSH is down to around > 3 and fT4 is up a little). > > After reading websites such as stopthethyroidmadness.org and the syndicated > newspaper column The Peoples' Pharmacy, it's tempting to jump to Armour > immediately. But I hesitate to "jack" my system with fast-acting T3 if I > really don't have to. My gut feeling is that gradual processes are easier on > the body than sudden ones, an analogy being crash dieting versus steady > weight loss. However, if the desired result simply cannot be obtained in a > gradual way, of course I would feel differently. And if I were unable to > function, I would also change my mind. > > The question I am leading to is, do people feel that it is the T4/T3 combo > of Armour that works, or is it the mysterious T1, T2, and possibly other > organic things within the natural thyroid that make it work? Does synthetic > T3 (Cytomel) have the same effect as Armour when added to synthetic T4? > > If so many doctors are against Armour, what are their main concerns besides > dose variability, which has pretty much been discounted at this point, I > believe? > > Thanks, > Elizabeth
From: willbill on 10 Apr 2008 14:37
Elizabeth wrote: > If so many doctors are against Armour, what are their main concerns besides > dose variability, which has pretty much been discounted at this point, I > believe? i've used insulin (a complex hormone) for 50.5 years T4 (and T3) are very simple hormone (1 amino acid each) it took me 40 years to learn that none of my docs (including 2 great endos) had/has a clue about insulin it's all about pharmaceutical profits, and not about whether or not you might actually do better with it i used synthetic insulin for 8.5 years, with marginal to poor results. so i *trust* natural products, like Armour thyroid and beef and pork insulin i do NOT have another 40 years learn another lesson Armour is the least expensive source of a bit of T3, which makes a lot of sense to me i like (!) taking a combo of mostly Armour and a bit of synthetic T4 upon rising in the morning (on an *empty* stomach!) bill |