From: Rich on

"john" <scu23(a)btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:6O6dnQNSa4ahVMLZRVny3g(a)bt.com...
>
> "Rich" <joshew(a)hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:W5L7g.14414$MP2.1699(a)tornado.socal.rr.com...
>>
>
>>
>> Bullshit. The virus in the smallpox vaccine is vaccinia, which is
>> genetically neither variola (smallpox) nor cowpox. It is produced in pure
>> culture these days, and no cows, monkeys, or horses are involved in the
>> process, nor is "pus." Although the vaccinia virus can produce disease in
>> immunosupressed individuals, the disease is not smallpox. Noone has ever
>> gotten smallpox from a vaccinia immunization. Lupton's lies from a
>> century ago are irrelevant. The truth of the matter is that smallpox
>> killed and disfigured millions of people over several thousand years, but
>> in only 180 years since the bold experiment by Dr. Jenner, this scourge
>> has been eliminated from the planet by the practice of vaccination.
>> --
>
> That may be true for late smallpox vaccines but as late as 1890 arm to arm
> vaccination was the most popular method.
> "The chief of the Public Health Department was clearly not aware that
> until a comparatively recent period arm-to-arm vaccination was practically
> the only method in vogue; and at the time Mr. Ritchie's declaration was
> made, to the effect that none of the lymph in use had passed through the
> human body, at least three-fourths of the lymph in use in the United
> Kingdom was the variety known as arm-to-arm vaccination virus."--William
> Tebb 1893
>
> "First came what was called "arm-to-arm vaccination." This consisted of
> inoculation with pus from the sore of a vaccinated person. Then it was
> arm-to-arm vaccination that became "one of the best established of medical
> facts" and "highly salutary to the human race." But, alas, for this
> improvement! Its continued practice brought the discovery that scrofula,
> tuberculosis, and even worse diseases latent in the constitution of the
> subject from whom the vaccine virus was taken, were being sown among the
> people.22 The growing doubt and agitation in the public mind finally led
> in England to the appointment of a Royal Commission -- to investigate the
> subject. This Commission, of which Lord Herschell was chairman, was in
> session for seven years -- from 1889 to 1896 -- and received the testimony
> of experts from all parts of the civilized world. Its report is comprised
> in fourteen folio volumes and constitutes the most exhaustive collection
> of medical evidence ever taken.23 Though out of the sixteen members of the
> Commission only three were anti-vaccinists yet the result of its
> investigation was the passage by Parliament of the "Conscience Clause" of
> the Vaccination Acts. This clause, passed in 1898, exempted from
> vaccination the children of parents who declared a conscientious objection
> to the practice. England, the birthplace of vaccination, after a century
> of experience of its disastrous effects, thus freed her people from its
> enforcement.24 The testimony taken before the Commission not only caused
> the enactment of the Conscience Clause, it proved also the death blow of
> arm-to-arm vaccination."---- John Pitcairn
>
> You should read the true story of Jenner, White
> http://www.whale.to/vaccines/white_b.html or Creighton
> http://www.whale.to/vaccines/creighton_b.html should do the trick.
>
> It is sufficient to reassert that Jenner did not introduce cowpox. On the
> contrary, he rejected cowpox for horsegrease cowpox; and such was his
> prescription because he knew from the evidence of his neighbourhood that
> cowpox afforded no protection from smallpox. It is true that when Pearson
> discredited horse-grease cowpox, and recommended cowpox, Jenner dropped
> his prescription, and put himself forward as the discoverer of cowpox; but
> it is also true that in subsequent years he resumed his original position,
> and indeed dispensed with the cow altogether, and, like Sacco of Milan and
> De Carro of Vienna, used and diffused horsegrease or horsepox neat,
> describing the equine virus as the true and genuine life-preserving
> fluid." [1885] The Story of a Great Delusion by William White
>
> It was an open secret in the profession that the great discoverer was a
> disappointing person at close quarters. He was vain, petulant, crafty, and
> greedy ; he had more of grandiloquence and bounce than of solid
> attainments. In London, at least, his presence was a bore, and his
> reputation an incubus, which the profession, outside his own small
> following, would have gladly got rid of. [1889] Jenner and Vaccination A
> Strange Chapter of Medical History by Charles Creighton M.D.


All this history has no relevance to the smallpox eradication in the 1960's
and 1970's. By that time smallpox vaccine was a consistent product,
manufactured using safe methods and containing a known vaccinia strain. The
methods used 130 years ago are understandable considering that they did not
have refrigeration to store vaccines and did not even know that the disease
is caused by a virus, much less about different strains, immune responses,
genetics of both virus and hosts, etc. It's interesting that while there are
still many orthopox viruses that are ostensibly named for their host
species, cowpox was misnamed, actually a disease of rodents that only
occasionally infected bovines. Monkeypox is carried by rodents as well. The
vaccinia virus that is now in smallpox vaccine is a genetic strain all its
own, mutated away from any orthopox of the nineteenth century long before we
had the technology to analyse and characterize the strains. Its origins are
thus lost in the history of early vaccination practices that you are so fond
of. But, as I said before, modern vaccines contain no smallpox, and your
notion that vaccination actually delayed the worldwide decline and
eradication of the disease is ill-founded.
--


--Rich

Recommended websites:

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
http://www.acahf.org.au
http://www.quackwatch.org/
http://www.skeptic.com/
http://www.csicop.org/


From: john on

"Max C." <maxc246(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1147135534.843139.322300(a)y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...

> http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/preparedness/bioterrorism/professionals/agents/smallpox/history/
> "In 1975, as a result of civil war and a flux of refugees, a ring
> leaked and smallpox blew out in Bangladesh (estimated population: 71
> million). It is estimated that 200,000 were infected and 40,000 died of
> the disease during the outbreak. The team mounted other ring
> vaccinations in an attempt to contain the outbreak. By the fall of
> 1975, they had controlled the last recorded outbreak of naturally-
> occurring variola major on Earth in an island off of Bangladesh."
>

It is hard to get rid of the vaccination brainwashing. They contained
smallpox in Leicester purely through sanitation methods, isolation etc, for
decades. No doubt if they had a bunch of vaccinators running around doing
"ring vaccination" they would claim it was vaccination that did the job.

Dr. Louis Parkes, Chairman of the Council of the Royal Sanitary Institute,
declared in 1922: " Our freedom from smallpox, therefore, could not be
attributed to vaccination. It was largely due to the preventive measures
taken at the ports, to the isolation of cases in hospitals, and to the
steps taken to control persons who had been exposed to infection." The Case
AGAINST Vaccination By M. BEDDOW BAYLY M.R.C.S., L.R.C.P.
http://www.vaccination.org.uk/vaccines/bayly.html

How do you think people would swallow that smallpox vax story if they knew
the real history of the first 130 or so years? If they knew it spread
leprsoy into Hawaii? If they knew most victims had been vaccinated, that it
was killing 6,000 children as late as 1920? That the stats show it was not
only completely useless but created epidemics? And if they knew what
happened in the Phillipines?

And if they knew that it wasn't that infectious, that one doc even claimed
it was only spread by bedbugs----

"This child, although living in the same room with the patients at the Pest
House, had not acquired the smallpox, after being exposed to it all of the
time for a period of six weeks; yet upon the fifth day after returning home,
this child acquired the initial fever. I then examined their house and found
it to be literally alive with bedbugs."---CHARLES A. R. CAMPBELL, M. D.
http://www.vaccination.org.uk/a/bedbugs.html

Even if that wasn't true, and fleas or droplets also were vectors, it
doesn't exactly paint it as highly infectious, now does it?


From: Max C. on
john wrote:
> Even if that wasn't true, and fleas or droplets also were vectors, it
> doesn't exactly paint it as highly infectious, now does it?

Not at all. Even the CDC's current documentation states that it's less
infectious than other diseases:

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5207a1.htm
"Airborne transmission has occurred rarely (2). Epidemiologic studies
have demonstrated that smallpox has a lower rate of transmission than
certain other diseases (e.g., measles, pertussis, and influenza)"

We've yet to see the "flu epidemic" we've been hearing about for so
many flu seasons now., so if smallpox is transmitted at a lower rate
than the flu, what is everyone so afraid of?

Mass smallpox vaccinations have proven ineffective. Histroy shows that
very clearly. And even *IF* there's a smallpox outbreak, the vaccine
can still be effective up to several days after exposure should one
choose to get vaccinated. There's no good reason for mass vaccination.

Max.

From: john on

"Max C." <maxc246(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1147181685.902507.256830(a)u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
> john wrote:
>> Even if that wasn't true, and fleas or droplets also were vectors, it
>> doesn't exactly paint it as highly infectious, now does it?
>
> Not at all. Even the CDC's current documentation states that it's less
> infectious than other diseases:
>
> http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5207a1.htm
> "Airborne transmission has occurred rarely (2). Epidemiologic studies
> have demonstrated that smallpox has a lower rate of transmission than
> certain other diseases (e.g., measles, pertussis, and influenza)"
>
> We've yet to see the "flu epidemic" we've been hearing about for so
> many flu seasons now., so if smallpox is transmitted at a lower rate
> than the flu, what is everyone so afraid of?
>
> Mass smallpox vaccinations have proven ineffective. Histroy shows that
> very clearly. And even *IF* there's a smallpox outbreak, the vaccine
> can still be effective up to several days after exposure should one
> choose to get vaccinated. There's no good reason for mass vaccination.
>
> Max.
>
Flu vaccine is the biggest con of the lot http://www.whale.to/v/quotes3.html

Science went out the window a century ago, its all politics which is the
game you play to fool the public.

Smallpox was a scare around 2002, I guess the medical lot refused to take it
which may be why they didn't force it on us, but they managed a big ?32
million hit on the UK taxpayer (?120 USA), so job done, and the fear levels
were kept up http://www.whale.to/b/smallpox_scare.html

the CDC have to make some attempt at facts (apart from the flu deaths lie)
but the media lie for them:

[2002] "But smallpox was, or is, a terrible, virulent disease. It kills one
out of every three of its victims. There is no cure."--CBS Media

"The statistic that is often quoted is that there are 25,000 kids infected
with Hepatitis B. After repeatedly asking the question as to how the CDC
arrived at this number, Harold S. Margolis, MD, Chief of the Hepatitis
Branch of the CDC finally admitted that 25,000 kids is simply an estimate.
They have no hard proof that there are definitely 25,000 kids with Hepatitis
B."--Lisa F. Reiss
"Every year in the United States, on average.......approximately 36,000
people die from flu." CDC October 6, 2004
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/keyfacts.htm
Number of flu deaths 753 (2002) CDC
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr52/nvsr52_13.pdf

"They (CDC, ACIP and Merck) are passing off estimated, hypothetical numbers
as actual cases. This is statistical fraud. In the financial world such
mis-representation would lead to criminal charges. If a company inflated its
earnings or revenues by 300% (as the CDC does hepatitis B disease
statistics) and foisted those figures off as official data (and not some
back-of-the-envelope guess-timate) - that company would be investigated by
the SEC and sued by shareholders. Why doesn't that happen in the medical
world? There's no regulator to keep the CDC honest. They do not say those
figures are hypothetical estimates, they misrepresent the data. Go try to
audit those 320,000 supposed new infections/yr. You will not find them. The
whole exercise is designed to increase public hysteria about the risk of a
low-risk disease so the CDC can extend it's pervasive influence and Merck
can increase it's $900 million/year vaccine revenues."---Michael Belkin
MICHAEL BELKIN'S WRITTEN TESTIMONY TO CONGRESS

I always know when it's flu season. First, the media begins its usual role
as hyterical government press secretary, uncritically trumpeting the same
cooked numbers about the coming flu epidemic. ... NBC's Today Show
(10/6/04), warn that the flu kills about 36,000 people every year in the
United States. .....It's a crock, a lie, and a sham; a conspiracy to
generate fear and stampede people to use a vaccine of questionable
effectiveness to the benefit of pro-immunization bureaucrats, and big
pharma. Sounds harsh, but follow the math and the money. When the major
manufacturers of flu vaccine get together with the CDC in a closed door
summit with the sole purpose of figuring out how to stick 185 million doses
of a questionable vaccine into a population in which less than 1,000 people
a year die, what should we call it? Yes, Virginia, it is a conspiracy.
Luckily the conspirators are foolish enough to believe that their website is
safely hidden amidst all the chaff of the Internet, or else, are so brazen
in their contempt for the general population that they think we can't do a
little math and conclude "The vaccine doesn't work, and the flu is a
flim-flam!" The CDC should concentrate on finding ways to lower the spread,
working alternatives to vaccines, and ways to minimizing the severity of the
flu, rather than pumping out fake numbers, creating an aura of fear and
hysteria, and shilling for profits to huge pharma companies. The Flu Scare
Game by John Keller




From: john on

"Max C." <maxc246(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1147181685.902507.256830(a)u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
> john wrote:
>> Even if that wasn't true, and fleas or droplets also were vectors, it
>> doesn't exactly paint it as highly infectious, now does it?
>

same old story, ?120 million every scare

[NVIC May 2006] Threat of bioterrorism
In what amounts to a catfight between drug companies competing for the same
government contract, Michigan's Bioport and the politicians that back the
company have secured more cash from taxpayers to prepare for a theoretical
bioterrorism attack on U.S. civilians. Yet, there is not one scintilla of
solid evidence that has been provided to the public since Sept. 11, 2001 by
the U.S. government that any terrorist group in the world has the scientific
expertise and capability to weaponize anthrax, smallpox or any other
microorganism and successfully deliver it in lethal form to large numbers of
civilians on the mainland.
This lack of evidence, however, does not deter the fear mongers
and profiteers, who continue to frighten the people into believing a
bioterrorism attack is imminent. And so large sums of taxpayer money is
handed over to drug companies to produce bioterrorism vaccines which can be
forced upon the people in order to recoup production expenses and generate
more profit for vaccine makers. http://www.whale.to/b/nvic12.html