From: bigvince on
Not really......
Probably not.
Cochrane Database Syst Rev. 2006 Jul 19;3:CD004876.Click here to read
Substance (MeSH Keyword), Cited in PMC

Vaccines for preventing influenza in the elderly.
Rivetti D, Jefferson T, Thomas R, Rudin M, Rivetti A, Di Pietrantonj
C, Demicheli V.

Servizio di Igiene e Sanita' Pubblica, Public Health Department, ASL
19 Asti, C. so Dante 202, Asti, Italy 14100..........

BACKGROUND: Influenza vaccination of elderly individuals is
recommended worldwide and has been targeted toward the elderly and
those at serious risk of complications. OBJECTIVES: Our aim was to
review the evidence of efficacy, effectiveness and safety of influenza
vaccines in individuals aged 65 years or older.......

....SELECTION CRITERIA: We considered randomised, quasi-randomised,
cohort and case-control studies assessing efficacy against influenza
(laboratory-confirmed cases) or effectiveness against influenza-like
illness (ILI)...

......MAIN RESULTS: Sixty-four studies were included in the efficacy /
effectiveness assessment, resulting in 96 data sets. In homes for
elderly individuals (with good vaccine match and high viral
circulation) the effectiveness of vaccines against ILI was 23% (6% to
36%) and non-significant against influenza (RR 1.04: 95% CI 0.43 to
2.51)....
.........In elderly individuals living in the community, vaccines were
not significantly effective against influenza (RR 0.19; 95% CI 0.02 to
2.01), ILI (RR 1.05: 95% CI 0.58 to 1.89), or pneumonia (RR 0.88; 95%
CI 0.64 to 1.20). Well matched vaccines prevented hospital admission
for influenza and pneumonia (VE 26%; 12% to 38%) and all-cause
mortality (VE 42%; 24% to 55%).....

.......AUTHORS' CONCLUSIONS: In long-term care facilities, where
vaccination is most effective against complications, the aims of the
vaccination campaign are fulfilled, at least in part. However,
according to reliable evidence the usefulness of vaccines in the
community is modest. The apparent high effectiveness of the vaccines
in preventing death from all causes may reflect a baseline imbalance
in health status and other systematic differences in the two groups of
participants.

PMID: 16856068 [PubMed -

How does a flu shot that does not protect against the flu reduce the
complications of the flu?

'The apparent high effectiveness of the vaccines in preventing death
from all causes may reflect a baseline imbalance in health status and
other systematic differences in the two groups of participants.'

1: Lancet Infect Dis. 2007 Oct;7(10):658-66....

Mortality benefits of influenza vaccination in elderly people: an
ongoing controversy.
Simonsen L, Taylor RJ, Viboud C, Miller MA, Jackson LA.

National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, National
Institutes of Health, Bethesda, MD, USA. iph...(a)gwumc.edu

Influenza vaccination policy in most high-income countries attempts to
reduce the mortality burden of influenza by targeting people aged at
least 65 years for vaccination. However, the effectiveness of this
strategy is under debate........

........Recent excess mortality studies were unable to confirm a
decline in influenza-related mortality since 1980, even as vaccination
coverage increased from 15% to 65%. Paradoxically, whereas those
studies attribute about 5% of all winter deaths to influenza, many
cohort studies report a 50% reduction in the total risk of death in
winter--a benefit ten times greater than the estimated influenza
mortality burden. New studies, however, have shown substantial
unadjusted selection bias in previous cohort studies........
.....We conclude that frailty selection bias and use of non-specific
endpoints such as all-cause mortality have led cohort studies to
greatly exaggerate vaccine benefits. The remaining evidence base is
currently insufficient to indicate the magnitude of the mortality
benefit, if any, that elderly people derive from the vaccination
programme.

PMID: 17897608 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
From: trigonometry1972 on

> PMID: 17897608 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

In long term care, the "immates" get 400 IU
or maybe 600 IU of vitamins D
whether they need it or not. Plus the home's idea of an
out of doors experience is the big picture window overlooking
the front lawn.

Whereas those living in the community, likely get
out in the sun and a few even take a larger supplement
of vitamin D and other vitamins.

Don't drink the green beer....................Trig
From: Happy Oyster on
On Sun, 18 Oct 2009 06:46:46 -0700 (PDT), bigvince <vince.miraglia(a)gmail.com>
wrote:

>........In elderly individuals living in the community, vaccines were
>not significantly effective against influenza (RR 0.19; 95% CI 0.02 to
>2.01), ILI (RR 1.05: 95% CI 0.58 to 1.89), or pneumonia (RR 0.88; 95%
>CI 0.64 to 1.20). Well matched vaccines prevented hospital admission
>for influenza and pneumonia (VE 26%; 12% to 38%) and all-cause
>mortality (VE 42%; 24% to 55%).....

That is a question of what the MEASURED facts are caused by and what is the
conclusion to draw for FUTURE acting.

Fact is, that older people ARE prone to die from lung infections. So, one
conclusion to draw is: vaccinations DO WORK to save the lives of elderly people.

Facts is, that older people in the lifetime before the tests ALREADY had more or
less strong infections, which of course had an effect on their immune system,
leaving some potential in their immune system.

BUT fact is also, that the immune system and the lung are NOT THE SAME! The more
damages by infections the lungs have, the less they can withstand newer
infections which in they their youth would have easily wiped off.


Conclusion: Vaccinaation IS a valuable prevention for elderly people, but
infections in their earlier life damaged the lungs, so that their situation is
worse than for younger people.

If infections are fought against by vaccinations in early age, the future
conditions for the older people are much better, because their lungs will not be
as damaged!

Aribert Deckers
..
--
How a sect kills YOUR children

http://www.pharmamafia.com
From: rpautrey2 on

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanatic

On Oct 18, 11:10 am, Happy Oyster <happy.oys...(a)ariplex.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 18 Oct 2009 06:46:46 -0700 (PDT), bigvince <vince.mirag...(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >........In elderly individuals living in the community, vaccines were
> >not significantly effective against influenza (RR 0.19; 95% CI 0.02 to
> >2.01), ILI (RR 1.05: 95% CI 0.58 to 1.89), or pneumonia (RR 0.88; 95%
> >CI 0.64 to 1.20). Well matched vaccines prevented hospital admission
> >for influenza and pneumonia (VE 26%; 12% to 38%) and all-cause
> >mortality (VE 42%; 24% to 55%).....
>
> That is a question of what the MEASURED facts are caused by and what is the
> conclusion to draw for FUTURE acting.
>
> Fact is, that older people ARE prone to die from lung infections. So, one
> conclusion to draw is: vaccinations DO WORK to save the lives of elderly people.
>
> Facts is, that older people in the lifetime before the tests ALREADY had more or
> less strong infections, which of course had an effect on their immune system,
> leaving some potential in their immune system.
>
> BUT fact is also, that the immune system and the lung are NOT THE SAME! The more
> damages by infections the lungs have, the less they can withstand newer
> infections which in they their youth would have easily wiped off.
>
> Conclusion: Vaccinaation IS a valuable prevention for elderly people, but
> infections in their earlier life damaged the lungs, so that their situation is
> worse than for younger people.
>
> If infections are fought against by vaccinations in early age, the future
> conditions for the older people are much better, because their lungs will not be
> as damaged!
>
> Aribert Deckers
> .
> --
>                  How a sect kills YOUR children
>
>                    http://www.pharmamafia.com

From: Mark Probert on
On Oct 18, 9:46 am, bigvince <vince.mirag...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>  Not really......
>     Probably not.

This is precisely why people who come in contact with the elderly, ill
and immunocompromised should be vaccinated against the flu, i.e. to
prevent infecting the elderly, ill and immunocompromised.


>  Cochrane Database Syst Rev. 2006 Jul 19;3:CD004876.Click here to read
> Substance (MeSH Keyword), Cited in PMC
>
>   Vaccines for preventing influenza in the elderly.
> Rivetti D, Jefferson T, Thomas R, Rudin M, Rivetti A, Di Pietrantonj
> C, Demicheli V.
>
> Servizio di Igiene e Sanita' Pubblica, Public Health Department, ASL
> 19 Asti, C. so Dante 202, Asti, Italy 14100..........
>
>  BACKGROUND: Influenza vaccination of elderly individuals is
> recommended worldwide and has been targeted toward the elderly and
> those at serious risk of complications. OBJECTIVES: Our aim was to
> review the evidence of efficacy, effectiveness and safety of influenza
> vaccines in individuals aged 65 years or older.......
>
>   ....SELECTION CRITERIA: We considered randomised, quasi-randomised,
> cohort and case-control studies assessing efficacy against influenza
> (laboratory-confirmed cases) or effectiveness against influenza-like
> illness (ILI)...
>
> .....MAIN RESULTS: Sixty-four studies were included in the efficacy /
> effectiveness assessment, resulting in 96 data sets. In homes for
> elderly individuals (with good vaccine match and high viral
> circulation) the effectiveness of vaccines against ILI was 23% (6% to
> 36%) and non-significant against influenza (RR 1.04: 95% CI 0.43 to
> 2.51)....
> ........In elderly individuals living in the community, vaccines were
> not significantly effective against influenza (RR 0.19; 95% CI 0.02 to
> 2.01), ILI (RR 1.05: 95% CI 0.58 to 1.89), or pneumonia (RR 0.88; 95%
> CI 0.64 to 1.20). Well matched vaccines prevented hospital admission
> for influenza and pneumonia (VE 26%; 12% to 38%) and all-cause
> mortality (VE 42%; 24% to 55%).....
>
> ......AUTHORS' CONCLUSIONS: In long-term care facilities, where
> vaccination is most effective against complications, the aims of the
> vaccination campaign are fulfilled, at least in part. However,
> according to reliable evidence the usefulness of vaccines in the
> community is modest. The apparent high effectiveness of the vaccines
> in preventing death from all causes may reflect a baseline imbalance
> in health status and other systematic differences in the two groups of
> participants.
>
> PMID: 16856068 [PubMed -
>
>   How does a flu shot that does not protect against the flu reduce the
> complications of the flu?
>
>  'The apparent high effectiveness of the vaccines in preventing death
> from all causes may reflect a baseline imbalance in health status and
> other systematic differences in the two groups of participants.'
>
>      1: Lancet Infect Dis. 2007 Oct;7(10):658-66....
>
>    Mortality benefits of influenza vaccination in elderly people: an
> ongoing controversy.
> Simonsen L, Taylor RJ, Viboud C, Miller MA, Jackson LA.
>
> National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, National
> Institutes of Health, Bethesda, MD, USA. iph...(a)gwumc.edu
>
> Influenza vaccination policy in most high-income countries attempts to
> reduce the mortality burden of influenza by targeting people aged at
> least 65 years for vaccination. However, the effectiveness of this
> strategy is under debate........
>
> .......Recent excess mortality studies were unable to confirm a
> decline in influenza-related mortality since 1980, even as vaccination
> coverage increased from 15% to 65%. Paradoxically, whereas those
> studies attribute about 5% of all winter deaths to influenza, many
> cohort studies report a 50% reduction in the total risk of death in
> winter--a benefit ten times greater than the estimated influenza
> mortality burden. New studies, however, have shown substantial
> unadjusted selection bias in previous cohort studies........
> ....We conclude that frailty selection bias and use of non-specific
> endpoints such as all-cause mortality have led cohort studies to
> greatly exaggerate vaccine benefits. The remaining evidence base is
> currently insufficient to indicate the magnitude of the mortality
> benefit, if any, that elderly people derive from the vaccination
> programme.
>
> PMID: 17897608 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]